Why is this such an important question in a discussion about God’s goodness and the problem of pain? Let’s put it this way. What kind of God would Yahweh be if He kicked Satan out of Heaven (remember, Eden was Heaven on earth) prior to creating mankind only to let the devil back in to tempt Eve?
Many people believe that Satan’s fall was primeval (before Creation). If that’s the case, it seem like it paints God in a very poor light. After all, if Satan could get back into Heaven after being kicked out, God would be either a) incompetent, or b) indifferent. Either way, it’s not a pretty picture. So, let’s look at the story of Satan’s fall from Heaven and find out if this event happened prior to Eden or sometime later.
Now war arose in heaven, Michael and his angels fighting against the dragon. And the dragon and his angels fought back, but he was defeated, and there was no longer any place for them in heaven. And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world—he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him. And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, “Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God. And they have conquered him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, for they loved not their lives even unto death. Therefore, rejoice, O heavens and you who dwell in them! But woe to you, O earth and sea, for the devil has come down to you in great wrath, because he knows that his time is short!”
Revelation 12:7-12 ESV
Notice that when Satan was thrown down from Heaven he was thrown down “to the earth.” Prior to the Genesis 1 Creation narrative, there was no earth (or land) for Satan to be thrown down to. While Satan was in Heaven, he was called “the accuser of our brothers,” which is a reference to a group of humans, of course. So, humans must have been in existence while Satan was in Heaven. Once he is thrown down, the earth and sea are warned about the devil’s wrath. So, Satan’s fall could not have been prior to the creation of the earth (land) and mankind.
Some point to Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28 as narratives about Satan. From my perspective, it’s far from conclusive that Satan is the bad guy here. Regardless, a quick glance through both passages quickly reveals that the fall of the supernatural bad guy(s) described in Isaiah and Ezekiel was not prior to Creation. In both cases, people are already in the picture when they are cast out. This isn’t quite as clear in Ezekiel, but in this passage, the “anointed guardian cherub” (v. 14) was placed in Eden, the same garden where Adam and Eve were placed very shortly after it was planted. And it sounds as if this cherub was “blameless” for some time before sinning (v. 15).
So again, Isaiah 14, Ezekiel 28, and Revelation 12 all point to the rebellion and subsequent exit from heaven of these supernatural being(s) as taking place after Creation and after Adam and Eve had been placed in the Garden. Now, why is this so important?
We’re asking how a good God could allow pain and suffering. Implied in that question is the question of whether God is good. So, what is God like? Is He the kind of God that kicks Satan out of Heaven and then knowingly lets the same monster back in to tempt Eve? That’s not the story that Scripture tells.
Now, did Satan sin before tempting Eve? Personally, I think that Satan’s temptation of Eve was his downfall (not his exit from heaven but his entry into sin. See the “Jesus, the Anointed High Priest” chapter for more on the timing of Satan’s exit from Heaven.) There’s no evidence in Scripture of Satan becoming the devil prior to this event. While we can’t really know with 100% certainty, I think this makes the most sense for a number of reasons. I’ve shared some of those here regarding the timing. The rest are beyond the scope of this blog post. Maybe we’ll get to that at another time.
But back to the question of God’s goodness. We’ve established that God didn’t let Satan sneak back into the Garden. So, if Satan’s temptation of Eve was his entry point into sin, why would a good God let that happen if He knew it would happen?
Up Next: The Problem of Pain: 9. Is God a Helicopter Parent?
Epic Gospel 
Hello, I am curious about a couple of points here. The original creation story first says God created the heaven and earth. Then is says that the spirit moved over the face of the water. If I am remembering correctly the word for water is translated more like “piss.” Please forgive the vulgarity. I have heard sermons regarding this that suggest that there is a period of time between these verses. That Satan was cast down to the earth that existed and destroyed it. God, separating the waters from the land, recreated what we know as Eden and the earth today. I am interested to know your understanding of these points as it pertains to this post. Thank you -Corinne
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Hi Corinne, good to hear from you! In Genesis 1:2, the Spirit of God is hovering over the surface of the “deep” (depending on the translation). This is the Hebrew word “tehom,” which is typically translated as “deep” or “abyss.” This term doesn’t carry a connotation of vulgarity, but it is associated with the chaos of the sea. The “deep/abyss” was there as an un-creation before God began to bring order through creation. Creation, for an ancient person, was not primarily about bringing matter into existence the way we might think today. Creation was more about putting into order what was chaotic or unordered. So, the “deep/abyss” carried with it the idea of uncreated disorder and chaos.
This idea of the “deep/abyss” is also developed in some Scriptural passages to refer to the realm of the dead (moving from life to death, a type of de-creation). For example, when Jonah sinks into the sea, he says that the “deep engulfed” him (Jonah 2:5) and the earth’s bars were around him (v. 6). This is language associated with Hades/Sheol, the realm of the dead having bars that locked people in. In the ancient perspective, Jonah died, having gone into the realm of the dead and was then brought back to life when the great fish vomited him out. This is also why Jesus mentions the sign of Jonah (Matt. 12:39) in reference to his coming death and resurrection. He is hinting that just as Jonah died and rose again, so also would He. So, the “deep/abyss” carries a deathly and/or primordial chaos/un-creation/de-creation sense of meaning rather than a meaning associated with vulgarity.
Regarding your second question about the gap of time between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2 and Satan’s being cast down, this is typically called the “gap theory.” I’m not an expert on this, but as far as I understand, it seems that it was introduced to try to reconcile a scientific belief in a very old earth with a literal 6-day creation account. (I might be oversimplifying this, but I think that’s the general idea.) When combined with the belief in a pre-Creation account of Satan’s fall, this has a number of issues. First, Genesis 2:3 indicates that God finished the creation of the heavens and the earth and all their “host.” This “host” includes the heavenly host. The creation of angels (including Satan) is typically viewed as possibly occurring on days 1 (creation of light, with angels being creatures of light) and/or 4 (creation of planets and stars, associated in Scripture and the ancient world with the “host of heaven”–e.g. Deut. 4:19-20, among others). In this case, Satan did not exist prior to the Creation account described in Genesis 1.
Regarding Satan’s fall, the idea of a pre-Creation fall of Satan from heaven was popularized by John Milton in Paradise Lost. This is not an ancient view and quickly becomes problematic when reading Revelation 12. Satan’s primary activity in Revelation 12 prior to his expulsion from heaven is accusing the brothers, meaning that the creation of humans had already occurred. Once thrown from heaven, he then pursues those who hold fast the testimony of Jesus, meaning that he was thrown from heaven near or after the time of Christ on earth. His expulsion is also associated with the birth of Christ (Rev. 12:5) and the ascension of Christ (also 12:5), indicating that Satan’s expulsion from heaven occurred in association with the kingdom of Jesus receiving all dominion after the dominion of the beasts is taken away (see Dan. 7). In Daniel 7, Jesus receives the kingdom upon his ascension, riding on the clouds into heaven to be seated at the right hand of God (compare Dan. 7 with Ps. 110:1, Matt. 26:64, and Acts 2:34).
I am inclined to view Genesis 3 as the devil’s first act of outward rebellion. It is the earliest problem that Scripture brings to light for us. The idea that Satan could have destroyed a previous world would also leave us with some philosophical problems about the nature of God. Scripture portrays God as the Creator, Sustainer, and Redeemer, the One Who brings life out of death. Even in the Flood, when the earth is de-created and re-created, God preserves a remnant. It is not a complete re-do (meaning that all life is completely destroyed). If God had a former world that was completely lost, it suggests that He was either incapable or unwilling to save it. Either option is incompatible with the God described in the Bible, Who is both all-powerful and Who is love. It also credits Satan with too much power. He is still a created being.
That’s a lot of information, but I hope it helps, Corinne!
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